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[UpRiverMatt]

Hey, I wanted to try out a new idea for a thread where we choose one topic and each reply with research or interesting information on the topic to build an understanding of it over time.

Something I’ve been curious about is how sunlight is healthy for us and how to replicate it in the cold winter months here in Canada!

My first question is why is sunlight healthy, how does that work. My second question is how can we create a way to get those benefits in winter or dark times of the year?

I will reply with more research I have later. I know the general idea is that sunlight penetrates our skin energizing the biochemical reactions going on there like creating vitamin D from a compound in our skin, and increasing the activity of enzymes like cytochrome c oxidase which helps us make more energy (CCO).

A problem I’ve had is that when I use things like red light therapy devices they just don’t seem to work or feel the same to me. I almost get a headache from using them – perhaps they’re too powerful and I need to stand further away, but I think there might be more to it than that. Sunlight doesn’t do the same thing even on a very powerfully sunny day for many hours.

[UpRiverGreg]

Cool thread idea, Matt!

To contribute, I’ll excerpt a little bit from my article on how to be more manly: (https://projectupriver.com/how-to-be-more-manly/)

“a 2012 study [4] performed on lab rats actually showed a significant T increase when a red light laser was shone on their testes for 5 days. That’s right, scientists actually blasted some rats balls with red light for 30 minutes a day for 5 days straight and found a significant increase in their manliness, ie test levels, after doing so. How significant, you’re probably wondering? On the fourth day, the rats who were treated with 670nm light had T levels roughly 6.7 times higher than the test case of rats who were not treated with light. Even better, upon investigation from the scientists, there was no damage found to the rats’ testes when treated with the 670nm frequency of light. This led them to conclude that red light therapy could potentially be used as an alternative method to treating men suffering from low T levels.”

Of course this needs to taken with grain of salt, as the experiments were only performed on rats, but it does provide a pretty interesting connection between red light and testosterone.

As for why red light seems to differ from actual sunlight, I dont know, but I have noticed a similar experience myself. Something about using red light just feels synthetic to me. It feels like there is something missing from it, almost as if its incomplete.

[UpRiverMatt]

Good start Greg, testosterone boosting is another effect of red light. There seems to be a theme of increased biological activity due to light.

I’d like to look into the wavelengths more too.

670nm is a good note on one of the wavelengths studied. Red light is 620 to 700nm, but beyond red light lies the infrared spectrum which is also beneficial. UV is what generates vitamin D as well. UVB seems to be beneficial, UVA seems to be harmful.

UV: 100 – 400nm
Red light: 620 – 700
Infrared: 700 – 1000

UVA 400 nm – 320 nm
UVB 320 nm – 290 nm
UVC 290 nm – 100 nm

Sunlight: a distribution between mostly 300nm and 1300nm that makes it though the atmosphere to sea level with some gaps in between. Maybe what’s missing in most light therapy is the proper amount of each wavelength that makes it to sea level.

“ Red and infrared light that falls within the wavelength range of 650-850 nm is extremely beneficial, and often referred to as the “therapeutic window”. These wavelengths of light are bioactive in humans, and affect the function of our cells.”

https://platinumtherapylights.com/blogs/news/red-light-therapy-what-is-it-and-how-does-it-work

Found this tidbit:
“Light therapy is among the earliest recorded healing modalities. Solar therapy was first used by the Egyptians [Resource], and forms of light therapy were also practised by the ancient Greeks, Chinese and Indians.”

I’ve also heard that Sunlight was one of the main factors that caused people to survive the influenza pandemic. Seems to boost immune function. Would need to research this more.

[UpRiverMatt]

Found this, which indicates UVA isn’t actually more dangerous just that it makes it through the atmosphere more. It makes sense because the longer the wavelength the less dangerous it seems to be.

“ Although both UVA and UVB are bad for skin, UVA rays are more of a threat because a much larger percentage of them reach earth’s surface”

[UpRiverMatt]

Matt Maruca is an interesting source on light therapy. He made raw optic blue light blocking glasses and knows some things about light.

Ben Greenfield has some good info as well.

[UpRiverMatt]

Best UV wavelengths for vitamin d generation is between 270 and 300. Glass windows block this wavelength but don’t block UVA.

https://www.sciencelearn.org.nz/resources/1313-vitamin-d-and-uv

[UpRiverMatt]

Mitochondria seem to be central to why light is good for us. It essentially is used as fuel like photosynthesis. I definitely notice a big boost in energy after being in the sun for a while.

“During a red light therapy treatment, chromophores within our cellular mitochondria absorb red and infrared light photons, and convert them into energy. Mitochondria are the powerhouses of cells, responsible for making adenosine triphosphate (ATP), the cell’s form of energy, and enhancing the consumption of oxygen.

Once this red light energy has been absorbed by the body, it is then used by the cells to build new proteins such as collagen and elastin, and assist with cellular regeneration. Red light give cells a helping hand, ensuring mitochondria reaches its potential by providing it with a full tank of fuel which results in optimal performance for the organism.

You could compare the process to photosynthesis, where plants absorb sunlight and convert it into complex molecules. In red light therapy, we absorb the energy of the red light photons to enhance our cellular potential, promote oxygen utilization within the cell, and generate ATP, or cellular fuel. [Resource]

There’s nothing mystical or new-agey about it–the process by which red light transforms bodily tissue at a cellular level has been scientifically proven. Improving the performance of mitochondria in the body improves the body’s overall performance and health.“

[UpRiverMatt]

Very interesting:
“ Photobiomodulation (PBM) also known as low-level level laser therapy is the use of red and near-infrared light to stimulate healing, relieve pain, and reduce inflammation. The primary chromophores have been identified as cytochrome c oxidase in mitochondria, and calcium ion channels (possibly mediated by light absorption by opsins). Secondary effects of photon absorption include increases in ATP, a brief burst of reactive oxygen species, an increase in nitric oxide, and modulation of calcium levels. Tertiary effects include activation of a wide range of transcription factors leading to improved cell survival, increased proliferation and migration, and new protein synthesis. There is a pronounced biphasic dose response whereby low levels of light have stimulating effects, while high levels of light have inhibitory effects. It has been found that PBM can produce ROS in normal cells, but when used in oxidatively stressed cells or in animal models of disease, ROS levels are lowered. PBM is able to up-regulate anti-oxidant defenses and reduce oxidative stress. It was shown that PBM can activate NF-kB in normal quiescent cells, however in activated inflammatory cells, inflammatory markers were decreased. One of the most reproducible effects of PBM is an overall reduction in inflammation, which is particularly important for disorders of the joints, traumatic injuries, lung disorders, and in the brain. PBM has been shown to reduce markers of M1 phenotype in activated macrophages. Many reports have shown reductions in reactive nitrogen species and prostaglandins in various animal models. PBM can reduce inflammation in the brain, abdominal fat, wounds, lungs, spinal cord.”

[UpRiverMatt]

This is pretty much the idea, but this is too expensive and for installing in homes not as much for personal use.

The LED sun: artificial light completely mimics properties of natural sunlight

[UpRiverMatt]

I might be the only one looking at this thread, but I’m going to get to the bottom of this haha.

This plant grow light is actually really close to what I’m looking for: https://www.azentive.com/sunondemand/

But it has more UV than sunlight so would need to check that.

[UpRiverMatt]

Same question in another forum: https://www.researchgate.net/post/Which-bulb-closely-replicates-the-sunlight-spectrum-on-earth

They’re saying to get an element to 6500 Kelvin to simulate the suns emission. Halogen or Xenon lights seem the closest to this.

[UpRiverGreg]

Very cool research on this topic, Matt.

I’m left wondering if there is still something missing from the equation in regards to replicating sunlight. Even if you got the wavelengths and element temperatures just right, would it truly have the same effect as the sun?

Without derailing the conversation too much could it be that there is some sort of spiritual connection that we humans innately have to that big flaming orb in the sky, that just can’t be artificially replicated, no matter what we do?

I’d love to have the oppurtunity to give that LED sun that you linked a try and see how it feels.

[UpRiverMatt]

I think the wavelengths yield many benefits that the sun has. I don’t know what else would be making it from the Sun to us besides the light itself. However, I would have to agree with your implication because you can’t replicate the experience of the sun itself, even if all the right wavelengths of light were there. You won’t beat lying on a floaty with a beer and rum ham on a beautiful sunny day with some pals. The big, beautiful orb in the sky has a lot more character than any setup you would be making.

That being said, there are some solid benefits that can be attained by replicating what we can, and that there is a lot of evidence already that we can do this effectively. I also know that you’re not going to be getting much sun in late November in Canada so it’s something or nothing. I find the current products out there only utilizing narrow bands of wavelengths could be improved upon to be more like sunlight, including helping us to generate vitamin D.

Right now I’m using a simple $25 dollar setup of halogen lights, but I’ve also tried high end products that cost hundreds of dollars (only covering a few wavelengths). I’m not too sure I even can tell which works better! Maybe I’ll try them both out some more.

Yeah that is interesting, but I’m not sure if it’s safe for humans! It would be cool to narrow down some products to see what has the most promise.

[UpRiverMatt]

UV light therapy is a thing and it has benefits for psoriasis and other skin conditions and potentially seasonal affective disorder (SAD). The question is what is a safe amount of UV and how do you incorporate that into a setup to get the full sun spectrum?

https://www.woundcarecenters.org/article/wound-therapies/ultraviolet-light-therapy

[UpRiverSpencer]

Wow this is actually all really cool. I was wondering, Matt, if you could put together a list of amazon products that would be able to mimic the effects of natural light or even red light exposure. Not just a mood light kind of thing (like Verilux), but actually something that might have some significant mitochondrial benefit? I’m thinking like a do-it-yourself kind of kit assembled from products easily purchased on Amazon.

Thanks so much!

[UpRiverMatt]

Hey Spencer, that’s what I’ve been trying to do, but I don’t know which lights are really comparable to sunlight. I pasted one above that’s used as a plant grow light. I also talked above about halogen lights which seem pretty close. I’ll look for some more this week.

[UpRiverMatt]

Made a post on light therapy incorporating most of this research: https://projectupriver.com/light-therapy/

[UpRiverMatt]

Photopuncture seems interesting, didn’t really get into it in my article.

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